Comments on: The Public Perception Of Civil Engineering http://blog.civilengineeringcentral.com/2009/04/30/the-public-perception-of-civil-engineering/ building teams . engineering careers Mon, 08 Mar 2010 15:04:02 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: SM Systems http://blog.civilengineeringcentral.com/2009/04/30/the-public-perception-of-civil-engineering/#comment-845 SM Systems Mon, 08 Mar 2010 14:38:54 +0000 http://civilengineeringcentral.wordpress.com/?p=1141#comment-845 What we are generally seeing across the world is a worsening issue of public infrastructure crumbling, or in slow decay, primarily because of lack of maintenance due to lack of funding. There is an ever increasing need of change and reconstruction and the civil engineer will be right at the forefront of this looming battle. This 800 pound gorilla in the corner can not be ignored for much longer. What we are generally seeing across the world is a worsening issue of public infrastructure crumbling, or in slow decay, primarily because of lack of maintenance due to lack of funding. There is an ever increasing need of change and reconstruction and the civil engineer will be right at the forefront of this looming battle. This 800 pound gorilla in the corner can not be ignored for much longer.

]]> By: David Perrings, PE http://blog.civilengineeringcentral.com/2009/04/30/the-public-perception-of-civil-engineering/#comment-289 David Perrings, PE Fri, 08 May 2009 22:09:28 +0000 http://civilengineeringcentral.wordpress.com/?p=1141#comment-289 this question of recognition has been brought up before. In one article by by Richard G. Weingardt, PE titled "The Great Bridge debuted 125 years ago" link is below http://www.gostructural.com/article.asp?id=2997 he asks the question "How are the great engineering project of today being recognized ?" The following is my response to his article. Richard, Regarding your question about the public recognition of outstanding structural engineering achievements today, it is an interesting question and I would be interested to read creative responses that you get back. I suppose the first question to ask regarding the "Great Bridge" is what factors contribute to its fame and what percentage is attributed to a structural engineering feet. My guess regarding structural engineering is very little. I think other factors weigh in more such as when it was built, the setting, the bridges impact on the local economy and the appearance of the bridge. I think that in order for something to acheive the status of the "Great Bridge" a lot more is in play then simply structural engineering. Your question reminds me of one of my favorite poems on the subject which I have included here and highlighted the part regarding bridges. I think the poem makes a powerfull point. Is this really a situation that needs to be corrected ? What value would it serve ? In the poem Monet speaks of no longer being able to see the wisteria separate from the bridge that it covers. Monet Refuses The Operation by Lisel Mueller Doctor, you say there are no haloes around the streetlights in Paris and what I see is an aberration caused by old age, an affliction. I tell you it has taken me all my life to arrive at the vision of gas lamps as angels, to soften and blur and finally banish the edges you regret I don't see, to learn that the line I called the horizon does not exist and sky and water, so long apart, are the same state of being. Fifty-four years before I could see Rouen cathedral is built of parallel shafts of sun, and now you want to restore my youthful errors: fixed notions of top and bottom, the illusion of three-dimensional space, wisteria separate from the bridge it covers. What can I say to convince you the Houses of Parliament dissolves night after night to become the fluid dream of the Thames? I will not return to a universe of objects that don't know each other, as if islands were not the lost children of one great continent. The world is flux, and light becomes what it touches, becomes water, lilies on water, above and below water, becomes lilac and mauve and yellow and white and cerulean lamps, small fists passing sunlight so quickly to one another that it would take long, streaming hair inside my brush to catch it. To paint the speed of light! Our weighted shapes, these verticals, burn to mix with air and change our bones, skin, clothes to gases. Doctor, if only you could see how heaven pulls earth into its arms and how infinitely the heart expands to claim this world, blue vapor without end. David Lewis Perrings, PE Civil Engineer P/A Design Resources, Inc. 2700 Ygnacio Valley Road, Suite 100 Walnut Creek, California 94598 Ph 925-210-9300 Fax 925-210-9303 dperrings@padesignresources.com this question of recognition has been brought up before. In one article by by Richard G. Weingardt, PE titled “The Great Bridge debuted 125 years ago” link is below

http://www.gostructural.com/article.asp?id=2997

he asks the question “How are the great engineering project of today being recognized ?”

The following is my response to his article.

Richard,

Regarding your question about the public recognition of outstanding structural engineering achievements today, it is an interesting question and I would be interested to read creative responses that you get back.

I suppose the first question to ask regarding the “Great Bridge” is what factors contribute to its fame and what percentage is attributed to a structural engineering feet. My guess regarding structural engineering is very little.

I think other factors weigh in more such as when it was built, the setting, the bridges impact on the local economy and the appearance of the bridge. I think that in order for something to acheive the status of the “Great Bridge” a lot more is in play then simply structural engineering. Your question reminds me of one of my favorite poems on the subject which I have included here and highlighted the part regarding bridges. I think the poem makes a powerfull point. Is this really a situation that needs to be corrected ? What value would it serve ?

In the poem Monet speaks of no longer being able to see the wisteria separate from the bridge that it covers.

Monet Refuses The Operation by Lisel Mueller

Doctor, you say there are no haloes
around the streetlights in Paris
and what I see is an aberration
caused by old age, an affliction.
I tell you it has taken me all my life
to arrive at the vision of gas lamps as angels,
to soften and blur and finally banish
the edges you regret I don’t see,
to learn that the line I called the horizon
does not exist and sky and water,
so long apart, are the same state of being.
Fifty-four years before I could see
Rouen cathedral is built
of parallel shafts of sun,
and now you want to restore
my youthful errors: fixed
notions of top and bottom,
the illusion of three-dimensional space,
wisteria separate
from the bridge it covers.
What can I say to convince you
the Houses of Parliament dissolves
night after night to become
the fluid dream of the Thames?
I will not return to a universe
of objects that don’t know each other,
as if islands were not the lost children
of one great continent. The world
is flux, and light becomes what it touches,
becomes water, lilies on water,
above and below water,
becomes lilac and mauve and yellow
and white and cerulean lamps,
small fists passing sunlight
so quickly to one another
that it would take long, streaming hair
inside my brush to catch it.
To paint the speed of light!
Our weighted shapes, these verticals,
burn to mix with air
and change our bones, skin, clothes
to gases. Doctor,
if only you could see
how heaven pulls earth into its arms
and how infinitely the heart expands
to claim this world, blue vapor without end.

David Lewis Perrings, PE
Civil Engineer
P/A Design Resources, Inc.
2700 Ygnacio Valley Road, Suite 100
Walnut Creek, California 94598
Ph 925-210-9300
Fax 925-210-9303
dperrings@padesignresources.com

]]> By: David Perrings, PE http://blog.civilengineeringcentral.com/2009/04/30/the-public-perception-of-civil-engineering/#comment-283 David Perrings, PE Wed, 06 May 2009 18:55:58 +0000 http://civilengineeringcentral.wordpress.com/?p=1141#comment-283 TO know what a civil engineer does all you have to do is look around you were ever you go, unless you are in some remote undiscovered part of the world the civil engineers work is everywhere. I think the great thing about Civil Engineering is that "being famous" has little to do with it. People leave us alone and we get to do challenging work and work on great projects. Civil Engineering to my knowelge is not based on "the star system". With all that civil engineers do and all the types of projects they do if you start trying to name a famous civil engineer your stuck with either a bridge engineer, dam engineer or one of two canals. You also need to go back many years to find these people and even after you have done that the person is only famous because the structure is famous. The Golden Gate Bridge, THe Brookland Bridge, Hoover Dam, Panama Canal. Personally I think Civil Engineers will always be unsung heros and I see that as a good thing. If a person has a need to be famous they need to head off to Hollywood, their chances are at least better then trying to be a famous engineer. As for Civil Engineering being SEXY, I suppose we could sponser a concrete bikini contest. TO know what a civil engineer does all you have to do is look around you were ever you go, unless you are in some remote undiscovered part of the world the civil engineers work is everywhere.

I think the great thing about Civil Engineering is that “being famous” has little to do with it. People leave us alone and we get to do challenging work and work on great projects. Civil Engineering to my knowelge is not based on “the star system”. With all that civil engineers do and all the types of projects they do if you start trying to name a famous civil engineer your stuck with either a bridge engineer, dam engineer or one of two canals. You also need to go back many years to find these people and even after you have done that the person is only famous because the structure is famous. The Golden Gate Bridge, THe Brookland Bridge, Hoover Dam, Panama Canal. Personally I think Civil Engineers will always be unsung heros and I see that as a good thing. If a person has a need to be famous they need to head off to Hollywood, their chances are at least better then trying to be a famous engineer.

As for Civil Engineering being SEXY, I suppose we could sponser a concrete bikini contest.

]]> By: LAND Engineering, plc http://blog.civilengineeringcentral.com/2009/04/30/the-public-perception-of-civil-engineering/#comment-278 LAND Engineering, plc Fri, 01 May 2009 20:20:40 +0000 http://civilengineeringcentral.wordpress.com/?p=1141#comment-278 Excellent points, and hats off to CEC for continuing in the uphill battle to promote our profession! I agree that at times the lack of public appreciation can be frustrating; but I suppose we bear it with the sense of internal satisfaction that most CEs would agree comes with the job. While this may seem to be waving a white flag, I just don't see perceptions changing. Civil engineering is one of the oldest professions of humanity. Outreach initiatives by the ICE or ASCE can only do limited good in terms of "educating," because as is frequently noted - there's nothing interesting to the public about public works and infrastructure. Perhaps initiatives could be discussed with the intent of raising the overall wages within the profession, but I think it's somewhat pointless, petty, and self-defeating to strive for the public adulation common to lawyers, doctors, and even architects. Excellent points, and hats off to CEC for continuing in the uphill battle to promote our profession!

I agree that at times the lack of public appreciation can be frustrating; but I suppose we bear it with the sense of internal satisfaction that most CEs would agree comes with the job. While this may seem to be waving a white flag, I just don’t see perceptions changing. Civil engineering is one of the oldest professions of humanity. Outreach initiatives by the ICE or ASCE can only do limited good in terms of “educating,” because as is frequently noted – there’s nothing interesting to the public about public works and infrastructure.

Perhaps initiatives could be discussed with the intent of raising the overall wages within the profession, but I think it’s somewhat pointless, petty, and self-defeating to strive for the public adulation common to lawyers, doctors, and even architects.

]]> By: aepcentral http://blog.civilengineeringcentral.com/2009/04/30/the-public-perception-of-civil-engineering/#comment-277 aepcentral Fri, 01 May 2009 01:50:03 +0000 http://civilengineeringcentral.wordpress.com/?p=1141#comment-277 Hi Joe...Thanks for your comment. I don't really think I missed the point as I ABSOLUTELY agree with YOU! If you watched the video you will see what a GREAT job ICE did promoting civil engineering; showing how necessary civil engineers are to our daily lives and the future of our lives. Through Civil Engineering Central, our BLOGs, our newsletters, we work to educate the non-engineering community. Keep reading! Hi Joe…Thanks for your comment. I don’t really think I missed the point as I ABSOLUTELY agree with YOU! If you watched the video you will see what a GREAT job ICE did promoting civil engineering; showing how necessary civil engineers are to our daily lives and the future of our lives. Through Civil Engineering Central, our BLOGs, our newsletters, we work to educate the non-engineering community. Keep reading!

]]> By: Joe Buongiorno http://blog.civilengineeringcentral.com/2009/04/30/the-public-perception-of-civil-engineering/#comment-276 Joe Buongiorno Fri, 01 May 2009 01:16:42 +0000 http://civilengineeringcentral.wordpress.com/?p=1141#comment-276 Carol you missed the point. The group was asked to name the most famous civil engineer. They were asked to name the civil engineer that would be a household name. In other words who would the general public associate with civil engineering? I am sure that many non medical people can name a famous doctor. Or the non legal folks can name a famous lawyer. But unless one is associated with civil engineering, I doubt anyone can name a famous civil engineer. The group did a great job in naming famous civil engineers and there are probably dozens more one can name. When I am asked what I do for a living, the question that I almost always get to my answer is "what is that you do." I do not think doctors and lawyers have to explain what they do. Oh sure they may have to explain there specialty within their profession. But even then, people understand the difference between corporate law and criminal law. Why is that? Well for one thing we do not do a good job of promoting ourselves. Why? If we were held at the same level of importance as doctors and lawyers, we would command a much higher level of compensation. Could you image the havoc that would happen if we started charging $300/ hour for out time? Another reason we get no attention is that every day the general public interfaces with the fruits of our labor. They do not think about the training and experience that one has to have to design that very long structure they drive over everyday on their way to work. They will, however pay the $300 per hour for an attorney to get the speeding ticket reduced or dismissed for speeding over the structure. Or they want the best doctor on the planet to may them whole after they crashed their car while speeding. They do not interface doctors and lawyers on a daily bases like they do with civil engineers. They turn on the tap and expect water to come out. They do not now or care what happens to their sanitary waste. They have no idea or could care less the amount of effort that was required to design the deep sea oil drilling platform that brings up the oil to heat their house, power their cares and is used to make all the medications they take. Here in NJ there is a magazine called NJ monthly. They always have a section on NJ top doctors or top lawyers. I never have seen one on NJ top engineers. If we want to be known, than we better start doing it ourselves because nobody is going to do it for us. Carol you missed the point. The group was asked to name the most famous civil engineer. They were asked to name the civil engineer that would be a household name. In other words who would the general public associate with civil engineering? I am sure that many non medical people can name a famous doctor. Or the non legal folks can name a famous lawyer. But unless one is associated with civil engineering, I doubt anyone can name a famous civil engineer. The group did a great job in naming famous civil engineers and there are probably dozens more one can name. When I am asked what I do for a living, the question that I almost always get to my answer is “what is that you do.” I do not think doctors and lawyers have to explain what they do. Oh sure they may have to explain there specialty within their profession. But even then, people understand the difference between corporate law and criminal law. Why is that? Well for one thing we do not do a good job of promoting ourselves. Why? If we were held at the same level of importance as doctors and lawyers, we would command a much higher level of compensation. Could you image the havoc that would happen if we started charging $300/ hour for out time? Another reason we get no attention is that every day the general public interfaces with the fruits of our labor. They do not think about the training and experience that one has to have to design that very long structure they drive over everyday on their way to work. They will, however pay the $300 per hour for an attorney to get the speeding ticket reduced or dismissed for speeding over the structure. Or they want the best doctor on the planet to may them whole after they crashed their car while speeding. They do not interface doctors and lawyers on a daily bases like they do with civil engineers. They turn on the tap and expect water to come out. They do not now or care what happens to their sanitary waste. They have no idea or could care less the amount of effort that was required to design the deep sea oil drilling platform that brings up the oil to heat their house, power their cares and is used to make all the medications they take. Here in NJ there is a magazine called NJ monthly. They always have a section on NJ top doctors or top lawyers. I never have seen one on NJ top engineers. If we want to be known, than we better start doing it ourselves because nobody is going to do it for us.

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